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Author Topic: Salt - Over 14 THOUSAND uses + a potential Renewable Energy Source  (Read 13 times)

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AGelbert

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Salt - Over 14 THOUSAND uses + a potential Renewable Energy Source

Discovery How Stuff Works : Salt

1,125,794 views


Manu John

Published on Apr 16, 2013

This prehistoric, life-saving material has more than 14,000 known uses, from food seasoning to road cleaning. The program considers how the molecular structure of sodium chloride allows it to be combined, broken apart, and mixed with other substances to create essential products. The presentation also profiles different methods of removing salt from the ground and the oceans, including solution mining, desalination, and dry salt mining.

How Stuff Works is about the stuff that powers our modern world. Follow the incredible journey of common goods from the ground to your table, car, closet, medicine cabinet, and places you may have never imagined.
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AGelbert

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Sodium chloride is a very stable chemical, so will only take part in reactions that require energy to be input. So it will never be an energy source, but an energy storage is possible, just like water.

Once again you failed to watch the video and embarrassed yourself by exposing your ignorance on the matter evidenced in the video. I subsequently researched the method shown in the video and confirmed that it is a possible future source of energy. 


I will give you an opportunity to apologize and retract your statement.

Yes, ionic bonds in molecules are generally difficult to break (require a large amount of energy) because they are so strong. Most rocks have ionic bonds. But, the ionic stability of NaCl is not an impediment to energy production here, Einstein.   

Also, anyone with half a brain knows salt can store thermal energy. That also is not part of this discussion, Mr. Pedant.

What IS part of the discussion is the fact that, by applying a certain RF energy beam to sea water, hydrogen is dissociated and can then be burned.

While it is true that the energy to generate the RF makes this process inefficient, and therefore instantly rejected by people like you, the fact is that a solar panel array, which lasts about 30 years, can make the ERoEI of this process positive WITHOUT any pollution costs. The reason for that is that is simple, though you have a consistent inability to grasp it.

We do not have to generate the photon energy that comes to us from the sun. Therefore, that input, that isn't going away any time soon, is the FREE portion of the Energy Invested (EI). While it is true that, once they have the giant solar arrays in place in the oceans, they may just go the electrolysis route (which is presently a tad more efficient), rather than the RF route to get the hydrogen from sea water, the fact is that RF energy CAN make use of NaCl in sea water as an energy source.

DON'T try to split hairs and claim the energy source is actually hydrogen from the water in the sea water. Yes, the hydrogen is the end product, but an integral part of the process is sea water. It is all discussed in the last ten minutes of the video. Please WATCH IT (go to the 39 minute mark) before you insert your pseudo-erudite foot in your mouth again.


If you do not apologize for your erroneous statement (Palloy: NaCL will never be an energy source), I will delete your post.


Could Giant “Solar Rigs” Floating On the Ocean Convert Seawater To Hydrogen Fuel? 

Scientists at Columbia University have designed a device that could make the process economically viable
By Randy Rieland

smithsonian.com

January 11, 2018

SNIPPET:

Usually, when we think about energy production at sea, we imagine giant oil rigs, or perhaps rows of towering wind turbines.  Recently, though, floating solar panels have been added to the mix, including a solar farm the size of 160 football fields that went into operation in China last year.

Now, a team of researchers at Columbia University wants to go a step farther. They say it’s possible to use solar panels on the ocean surface to power devices that can produce hydrogen fuel from seawater.

Hydrogen is a clean form of energy, but it’s most commonly produced from natural gas in a process that also releases carbon dioxide, a key driver of climate change. The Columbia scientists say their device, called a floating photovoltaic electrolyzer, eliminates that consequence by instead utilizing electrolysis to separate oxygen and hydrogen in water molecules, and then storing the latter for use as fuel.

Team leader Daniel Esposito, an assistant professor of chemical engineering, points out that using existing commercial electrolyzers to generate hydrogen is pretty costly. “If you take off-the-shelf solar panels and commercially available electrolyzers, and you use sunlight to split water into hydrogen and oxygen, it’s going to be three to six times more expensive than if you were to produce hydrogen from natural gas,” he says.

He also notes that those electrolyzers require membranes to keep the oxygen and hydrogen molecules separated once they’re split apart. That not only adds to the cost, but those parts would tend to degrade quickly when exposed to the contaminants and microbes in saltwater.

“Being able to safely demonstrate a device that can perform electrolysis without a membrane brings us another step closer to making seawater electrolysis possible,” Jack Davis, a researcher and lead author of the proof-of-concept study, said in a statement. “These solar fuel generators are essentially artificial photosynthesis systems, doing the same thing that plants do with photosynthesis, so our device may open up all kinds of opportunities to generate clean, renewable energy.”

image: https://public-media.smithsonianmag.com/filer/92/bb/92bbd7e7-eb6b-4b21-a633-1c9297468e6e/schematic_side_view.jpg

Two mesh electrodes are held at a narrow separation distance (L), and generate H2 and O2 gases concurrently. The key innovation is the asymmetric placement of the catalyst on the outward facing surfaces of the mesh, such that the generation of bubbles is constrained to this region. When the gas bubbles detach, their buoyancy causes them to float upward into separate collection chambers. (Daniel Esposito/Columbia Engineering)

Bubbling up

So, what makes their electrolyzer distinctive? 

The device is built around electrodes of titanium mesh suspended in water and separated by a small distance. When an electrical current is applied, the oxygen and hydrogen molecules split apart, with the former developing gas bubbles on the electrode that’s positively charged, and the latter doing the same on the one with a negative charge.

It’s critical to keep these different gas bubbles separated, and the Columbia electrolyzer does this through the application of a catalyst to only one side of each mesh component—the surface farthest away from the other electrode. When the bubbles get larger and detach from the mesh, they float up along the outside edges of each electrode instead of mixing together in the space between them.


Read more: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/innovation/could-giant-solar-rigs-floating-on-ocean-convert-seawater-to-hydrogen-fuel-180967750/#kzIlsDZWEKSsBLmC.99
Give the gift of Smithsonian magazine for only $12! http://bit.ly/1cGUiGv
Follow us: @SmithsonianMag on Twitter
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AGelbert

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United States (12) Patent Application Publication (10) Pub. No.: US 2009/0294300 A1
US 200902943 00A1 Kanzius (43) Pub. Date: Dec. 3, 2009
(54) RF SYSTEMS AND METHODS FOR PROCESSING SALT WATER

(75) Inventor: John Kanzius, Erie, PA (US); Mary Ann Kanzius, legal representative, Erie, PA (US)

(57) ABSTRACT

Systems and methods for processing salt water and/or solutions containing salt water with RF energy. Exemplary systems and methods may use RF energy to combust salt water, ...

https://patentimages.storage.googleapis.com/5a/24/85/636f65a00d04fd/US20090294300A1.pdf


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AGelbert

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Az asks: TECHNOLOGY LIKE THIS EXISTS BUT WE’RE STILL USING OIL, GAS & COAL?

Besides the possibility of extremely low cost energy (no matter how "freely available" the energy is, somebody will have to be paid to mind the machines that process it  8)), the fact is that the problem has never been about ENERGY itself, as the Palloys  of this world loudly claim in a half truth medley of sophistic discourse.

As I just posted on my channel, which prompted Palloy to stick his pseudo-erudite "high energy density" foot in his mouth, RF energy gleaned from photvoltaics can easily provide unlimited hydrogen from sea water.

We are, for all practical purposes, NEVER going to run out of salt, water or solar photons. And then there is geothermal, another, for all practical purposes, endlesss free energy source.

But, there is an answer to your your topic title that does not require some exercise in ERoEI (pollution costs excluding, of course ) math the Palloys of this world revel in (see below).






As you can see, obtaining the most cost effective and reliable, non-polluting, human standard of living improving, endlessly available ENERGY DOES NOT HAVE JACK S H I T to do with how we get our energy in this corrupt society.
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AGelbert

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Agelbert NOTE: Recently I posted on how a Radio Frquency (RF) beam on sea water causes it to burn by dissociating the hydrogen in the water. The device will not work unless NaCl is present in approximately the same concentration level as NaCl in sea water, making it a promising form of obtaining energy. I even posted the patent abstract.

Here is another promising use of seawater to generate energy ,  despite what pseudo-erudite people like Palloy may claim to the contrary.

Phys.org

May 20, 2016

Electricity ⚡ from seawater: New method efficiently produces hydrogen peroxide for fuel cells 

May 20, 2016 by Lisa Zyga, Phys.org feature


Credit: Mr. William Folsom, NOAA, NMFS

(Phys.org)—Scientists have used sunlight to turn seawater (H2O) into hydrogen peroxide (H2O2), which can then be used in fuel cells to generate electricity. It is the first photocatalytic method of H2O2 production that achieves a high enough efficiency so that the H2O2 can be used in a fuel cell.

The researchers, led by Shunichi Fukuzumi at Osaka University, have published a paper on the new method of the photocatalytic production of hydrogen peroxide in a recent issue of Nature Communications.

Quote
"The most earth-abundant resource, seawater, is utilized to produce a solar fuel that is H2O2," Fukuzumi told Phys.org.

The biggest advantage of using liquid H2O2 instead of gaseous hydrogen (H2), as most fuel cells today use, is that the liquid form is much easier to store at high densities. Typically, H2 gas must be either highly compressed, or in certain cases, cooled to its liquid state at cryogenic temperatures. In contrast, liquid H2O2 can be stored and transported at high densities much more easily and safely.

The problem is that that, until now, there has been no efficient photocatalytic method of producing liquid H2O2. (There are ways to produce H2O2 that don't use sunlight, but they require so much energy that they are not practical for use in a method whose goal is to produce energy.)

In the new study, the researchers developed a new photoelectrochemical cell, which is basically a solar cell that produces H2O2. When sunlight illuminates the photocatalyst, the photocatalyst absorbs photons and uses the energy to initiate chemical reactions (seawater oxidation and the reduction of O2) in a way that ultimately produces H2O2.

After illuminating the cell for 24 hours, the concentration of H2O2 in the seawater reached about 48 mM, which greatly exceeds previous reported values of about 2 mM in pure water. Investigating the reason for this big difference, the researchers found that the negatively charged chlorine in seawater is mainly responsible for enhancing the photocatalytic activity and yielding the higher concentration.

Overall, the system has a total solar-to-electricity efficiency of 0.28%. (The photocatalytic production of H2O2 from seawater has an efficiency of 0.55%, and the fuel cell has an efficiency of 50%.)

Although the total efficiency compares favorably to that of some other solar-to-electricity sources, such as switchgrass (0.2%), it is still much lower than the efficiency of conventional solar cells. The researchers expect that the efficiency can be improved in the future by using better materials in the photoelectrochemical cell, and they also plan to find methods to reduce the cost of production.

"In the future, we plan to work on developing a method for the low-cost, large-scale production of H2O2 from seawater," Fukuzumi said. "This may replace the current high-cost production of H2O2 from H2 (from mainly natural gas) and O2."

More information: Kentaro Mase et al. "Seawater usable for production and consumption of hydrogen peroxide as a solar fuel." Nature Communications. DOI: 10.1038/ncomms11470

 https://phys.org/news/2016-05-electricity-seawater-method-efficiently-hydrogen.html#jCp
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